Tabs to 4 spaces
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Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ?
Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... Thanks Jacques |
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+1
:) Jacques Le Roux wrote: > Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? > > Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... > > In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 > > JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... > > Thanks > > Jacques > |
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If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes
Jacques From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> > +1 > :) > > Jacques Le Roux wrote: >> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >> >> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... >> >> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >> >> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... >> >> Thanks >> >> Jacques >> > |
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I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have been merged
Jacques From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> > If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes > > Jacques > > From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >> +1 >> :) >> >> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>> >>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... >>> >>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>> >>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Jacques >>> >> > |
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If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no functionnal change.
Jacques From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have been merged > > Jacques > > From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>> +1 >>> :) >>> >>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>> >>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... >>>> >>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>> >>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> Jacques >>>> >>> >> > |
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Does it worth to replace tabs in third party javascript files? Probably the new versions of these files will be full of tabs, again. Bilgin On Jan 22, 2009, at 9:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux wrote: > If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no > functionnal change. > > Jacques > > From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will >> have been merged >> Jacques >> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some >>> days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>> Jacques >>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>> +1 >>>> :) >>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily >>>>> replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>> >>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs >>>>> in them... >>>>> >>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>> >>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>> outside... >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>> >>> >> |
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Yes Bilgin, that's true indeed. I will let them like that...
Thanks Jacques From: "Bilgin Ibryam" <[hidden email]> > > Does it worth to replace tabs in third party javascript files? > Probably the new versions of these files will be full of tabs, again. > > Bilgin > > On Jan 22, 2009, at 9:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux wrote: > >> If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no >> functionnal change. >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will >>> have been merged >>> Jacques >>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some >>>> days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>>> Jacques >>>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>>> +1 >>>>> :) >>>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily >>>>>> replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs >>>>>> in them... >>>>>> >>>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>>> >>>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>>> outside... >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> Jacques >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> > |
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In reply to this post by Jacques Le Roux
Sorry for my late response, I've been away from a pc for a couple of days.
We've had debates about tabs versus spaces several times and this quote reflects my opinion: "The debate over whether to use tab characters or spaces for indenting code is probably as old as Fortran. In fact, the arguing over this topic has led to many a newsgroup and mailing-list flame war, many whose intensity far surpass any Saturday night Quake Area session your thirteen brother ever saw. Well, I'm here to set the record straight on why tabs are a better choice. Like good object oriented design, it's simply a matter of recognizing the correct abstractions and encapsulating them appropriately... A tab in this context represents a unit of indentation, which should be separate from the "physical" size of the representation of that unit (on the screen). I happen to set all my editors to render that unit as equivalent to 4 spaces on the screen (even though the file only knows there is one unit of indentation, the tab character), but you may set your editor to render it as 2, 4, 8, or 100 spaces - whatever floats your boat. Point is, I don't care how big you want the indentation unit to be, and you shouldn't have to care how big I want(ed) it either. Any decent editor will let you control how tabs are rendered, and should preserve them in the file regardless of how they were rendered on the screen. By always using tabs, my code always looks consistent when I write it and you can always make it the indentation as big or small you want it. What is important to the notion of a "unit of indentation" is not the size of the indents, but rather the position of statements relative to each other. Using tabs all the time preserves that property, but using spaces unnecessarily merges the notion of your or my particular visual choice with the notion of relative positioning. The more important effect of using tabs is that we abstract out the "unit of indentation" and each implement it with whatever number of "simulated" spaces we prefer. Later, if I decide my indentation unit rendering is not the right size for me, I don't have to go change a bunch of existing code to be consistent nor do you have to even know I changed my mind. Now, isn't that beautiful? I wish everyone would see this and quit using spaces to indent code and, more generally, trying to make coding standards that specify such a "personal preference" kind of thing."" So is this patch really worth the trouble? -Jeroen On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux < [hidden email]> wrote: > If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no > functionnal change. > > > Jacques > > From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> > >> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have been >> merged >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >> >>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. >>> It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>> >>>> +1 >>>> :) >>>> >>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>> >>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace >>>>> all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>> >>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in >>>>> them... >>>>> >>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>> >>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>> outside... >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> |
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Actually it's just a matter of convention and we chose this one http://java.sun.com/docs/codeconv/html/CodeConventions.doc3.html#313
The intention is to get rid of most of all these comments and changes we have to do as commiters... Patch ahead : 800 KB, 14574 lines (not the bigger I did, changing licence headers was twice bigger) Jacques From: "Jeroen van der Wal" <[hidden email]> > Sorry for my late response, I've been away from a pc for a couple of days. > We've had debates about tabs versus spaces several times and this quote > reflects my opinion: > > "The debate over whether to use tab characters or spaces for indenting code > is probably as old as Fortran. In fact, the arguing over this topic has led > to many a newsgroup and mailing-list flame war, many whose intensity far > surpass any Saturday night Quake Area session your thirteen brother ever > saw. > Well, I'm here to set the record straight on why tabs are a better choice. > Like good object oriented design, it's simply a matter of recognizing the > correct abstractions and encapsulating them appropriately... > > A tab in this context represents a unit of indentation, which should be > separate from the "physical" size of the representation of that unit (on the > screen). I happen to set all my editors to render that unit as equivalent to > 4 spaces on the screen (even though the file only knows there is one unit of > indentation, the tab character), but you may set your editor to render it as > 2, 4, 8, or 100 spaces - whatever floats your boat. Point is, I don't care > how big you want the indentation unit to be, and you shouldn't have to care > how big I want(ed) it either. Any decent editor will let you control how > tabs are rendered, and should preserve them in the file regardless of how > they were rendered on the screen. > > By always using tabs, my code always looks consistent when I write it and > you can always make it the indentation as big or small you want it. What is > important to the notion of a "unit of indentation" is not the size of the > indents, but rather the position of statements relative to each other. Using > tabs all the time preserves that property, but using spaces unnecessarily > merges the notion of your or my particular visual choice with the notion of > relative positioning. > > The more important effect of using tabs is that we abstract out the "unit of > indentation" and each implement it with whatever number of "simulated" > spaces we prefer. Later, if I decide my indentation unit rendering is not > the right size for me, I don't have to go change a bunch of existing code to > be consistent nor do you have to even know I changed my mind. > Now, isn't that beautiful? I wish everyone would see this and quit using > spaces to indent code and, more generally, trying to make coding standards > that specify such a "personal preference" kind of thing."" > > So is this patch really worth the trouble? > > -Jeroen > > > On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux < > [hidden email]> wrote: > >> If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no >> functionnal change. >> >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >> >>> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have been >>> merged >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>> >>>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. >>>> It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>>> >>>> Jacques >>>> >>>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>> >>>>> +1 >>>>> :) >>>>> >>>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace >>>>>> all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in >>>>>> them... >>>>>> >>>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>>> >>>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>>> outside... >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> Jacques >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> > |
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I totally agree to follow a convention but the first line in the convention
says "The exact construction of the indentation (spaces vs. tabs) is unspecified.". So there's no need to replace tabs into spaces according to the convention. -Jeroen On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Jacques Le Roux < [hidden email]> wrote: > Actually it's just a matter of convention and we chose this one > http://java.sun.com/docs/codeconv/html/CodeConventions.doc3.html#313 > > The intention is to get rid of most of all these comments and changes we > have to do as commiters... > > Patch ahead : 800 KB, 14574 lines (not the bigger I did, changing licence > headers was twice bigger) > > Jacques > > From: "Jeroen van der Wal" <[hidden email]> > > Sorry for my late response, I've been away from a pc for a couple of days. >> We've had debates about tabs versus spaces several times and this quote >> reflects my opinion: >> >> "The debate over whether to use tab characters or spaces for indenting >> code >> is probably as old as Fortran. In fact, the arguing over this topic has >> led >> to many a newsgroup and mailing-list flame war, many whose intensity far >> surpass any Saturday night Quake Area session your thirteen brother ever >> saw. >> Well, I'm here to set the record straight on why tabs are a better choice. >> Like good object oriented design, it's simply a matter of recognizing the >> correct abstractions and encapsulating them appropriately... >> >> A tab in this context represents a unit of indentation, which should be >> separate from the "physical" size of the representation of that unit (on >> the >> screen). I happen to set all my editors to render that unit as equivalent >> to >> 4 spaces on the screen (even though the file only knows there is one unit >> of >> indentation, the tab character), but you may set your editor to render it >> as >> 2, 4, 8, or 100 spaces - whatever floats your boat. Point is, I don't care >> how big you want the indentation unit to be, and you shouldn't have to >> care >> how big I want(ed) it either. Any decent editor will let you control how >> tabs are rendered, and should preserve them in the file regardless of how >> they were rendered on the screen. >> >> By always using tabs, my code always looks consistent when I write it and >> you can always make it the indentation as big or small you want it. What >> is >> important to the notion of a "unit of indentation" is not the size of the >> indents, but rather the position of statements relative to each other. >> Using >> tabs all the time preserves that property, but using spaces unnecessarily >> merges the notion of your or my particular visual choice with the notion >> of >> relative positioning. >> >> The more important effect of using tabs is that we abstract out the "unit >> of >> indentation" and each implement it with whatever number of "simulated" >> spaces we prefer. Later, if I decide my indentation unit rendering is not >> the right size for me, I don't have to go change a bunch of existing code >> to >> be consistent nor do you have to even know I changed my mind. >> Now, isn't that beautiful? I wish everyone would see this and quit using >> spaces to indent code and, more generally, trying to make coding standards >> that specify such a "personal preference" kind of thing."" >> >> So is this patch really worth the trouble? >> >> -Jeroen >> >> >> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux < >> [hidden email]> wrote: >> >> If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no >>> functionnal change. >>> >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>> >>> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have >>>> been >>>> merged >>>> >>>> Jacques >>>> >>>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>> >>>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some >>>>> days. >>>>> It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>>> >>>>> +1 >>>>>> :) >>>>>> >>>>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace >>>>>>> all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in >>>>>>> them... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>>>> outside... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> |
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Trying to use this literally, the interpretation is: indent with 4 spaces, and don't ever use tabs. It says: "Four spaces should be used as the unit of indentation. The exact construction of the indentation (spaces vs. tabs) is unspecified. Tabs must be set exactly every 8 spaces (not 4)." If tabs must be set exactly 8 spaces, how can you use that to indent 4 spaces? Only use a tab to represent two levels of indentation? This part of it is really poorly worded, and who knows what they were trying to express. To keep things consistently formatted the only options are to stick with all tabs or all spaces, and for the formatting to be consistent among multiple people spaces are the only option otherwise different tab settings will result in different code formatting. A huge deal? Nope. That's why we've chosen to keep it simple: always use 4 spaces. The problems arise when people don't do things consistently, and then we end up with others cleaning up formatting while making other changes and patches and commits become full of irrelevant changes, making them hard to review, etc. If we all stick to it (and correct with formatting only commits that don't do anything else) then it's not a problem. So: 4 spaces, 4 spaces, 4 spaces. It's that simple. Yes, people could debate all day, but keeping it on a pragmatic level, this is all we need. -David On Jan 23, 2009, at 2:53 AM, Jeroen van der Wal wrote: > I totally agree to follow a convention but the first line in the > convention > says "The exact construction of the indentation (spaces vs. tabs) is > unspecified.". So there's no need to replace tabs into spaces > according to > the convention. > > -Jeroen > > On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Jacques Le Roux < > [hidden email]> wrote: > >> Actually it's just a matter of convention and we chose this one >> http://java.sun.com/docs/codeconv/html/CodeConventions.doc3.html#313 >> >> The intention is to get rid of most of all these comments and >> changes we >> have to do as commiters... >> >> Patch ahead : 800 KB, 14574 lines (not the bigger I did, changing >> licence >> headers was twice bigger) >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Jeroen van der Wal" <[hidden email]> >> >> Sorry for my late response, I've been away from a pc for a couple >> of days. >>> We've had debates about tabs versus spaces several times and this >>> quote >>> reflects my opinion: >>> >>> "The debate over whether to use tab characters or spaces for >>> indenting >>> code >>> is probably as old as Fortran. In fact, the arguing over this >>> topic has >>> led >>> to many a newsgroup and mailing-list flame war, many whose >>> intensity far >>> surpass any Saturday night Quake Area session your thirteen >>> brother ever >>> saw. >>> Well, I'm here to set the record straight on why tabs are a better >>> choice. >>> Like good object oriented design, it's simply a matter of >>> recognizing the >>> correct abstractions and encapsulating them appropriately... >>> >>> A tab in this context represents a unit of indentation, which >>> should be >>> separate from the "physical" size of the representation of that >>> unit (on >>> the >>> screen). I happen to set all my editors to render that unit as >>> equivalent >>> to >>> 4 spaces on the screen (even though the file only knows there is >>> one unit >>> of >>> indentation, the tab character), but you may set your editor to >>> render it >>> as >>> 2, 4, 8, or 100 spaces - whatever floats your boat. Point is, I >>> don't care >>> how big you want the indentation unit to be, and you shouldn't >>> have to >>> care >>> how big I want(ed) it either. Any decent editor will let you >>> control how >>> tabs are rendered, and should preserve them in the file regardless >>> of how >>> they were rendered on the screen. >>> >>> By always using tabs, my code always looks consistent when I write >>> it and >>> you can always make it the indentation as big or small you want >>> it. What >>> is >>> important to the notion of a "unit of indentation" is not the size >>> of the >>> indents, but rather the position of statements relative to each >>> other. >>> Using >>> tabs all the time preserves that property, but using spaces >>> unnecessarily >>> merges the notion of your or my particular visual choice with the >>> notion >>> of >>> relative positioning. >>> >>> The more important effect of using tabs is that we abstract out >>> the "unit >>> of >>> indentation" and each implement it with whatever number of >>> "simulated" >>> spaces we prefer. Later, if I decide my indentation unit rendering >>> is not >>> the right size for me, I don't have to go change a bunch of >>> existing code >>> to >>> be consistent nor do you have to even know I changed my mind. >>> Now, isn't that beautiful? I wish everyone would see this and quit >>> using >>> spaces to indent code and, more generally, trying to make coding >>> standards >>> that specify such a "personal preference" kind of thing."" >>> >>> So is this patch really worth the trouble? >>> >>> -Jeroen >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux < >>> [hidden email]> wrote: >>> >>> If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no >>>> functionnal change. >>>> >>>> >>>> Jacques >>>> >>>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>> >>>> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will >>>> have >>>>> been >>>>> merged >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>>> >>>>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some >>>>>> days. >>>>>> It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>>>>> >>>>>> Jacques >>>>>> >>>>>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>>>> >>>>>> +1 >>>>>>> :) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily >>>>>>> replace >>>>>>>> all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 >>>>>>>> tabs in >>>>>>>> them... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>>>>> outside... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>> |
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From: "David E Jones" <[hidden email]>
> Trying to use this literally, the interpretation is: indent with 4 spaces, and don't ever use tabs. > > It says: "Four spaces should be used as the unit of indentation. The exact construction of the indentation (spaces vs. tabs) is > unspecified. Tabs must be set exactly every 8 spaces (not 4)." > > If tabs must be set exactly 8 spaces, how can you use that to indent 4 spaces? Only use a tab to represent two levels of > indentation? This part of it is really poorly worded, and who knows what they were trying to express. I think that the idea is to show tabs by indenting them twice in the editor. Itdoes not mean that you will save them as 8 spaces. Hence this allows you to more easily spot tabs in code and replace them with 4 spaces. My 2cts Jacques > To keep things consistently formatted the only options are to stick with all tabs or all spaces, and for the formatting to be > consistent among multiple people spaces are the only option otherwise different tab settings will result in different code > formatting. > > A huge deal? Nope. That's why we've chosen to keep it simple: always use 4 spaces. > > The problems arise when people don't do things consistently, and then we end up with others cleaning up formatting while making > other changes and patches and commits become full of irrelevant changes, making them hard to review, etc. If we all stick to it > (and correct with formatting only commits that don't do anything else) then it's not a problem. > > So: 4 spaces, 4 spaces, 4 spaces. It's that simple. > > Yes, people could debate all day, but keeping it on a pragmatic level, this is all we need. > > -David > > > On Jan 23, 2009, at 2:53 AM, Jeroen van der Wal wrote: > >> I totally agree to follow a convention but the first line in the convention >> says "The exact construction of the indentation (spaces vs. tabs) is >> unspecified.". So there's no need to replace tabs into spaces according to >> the convention. >> >> -Jeroen >> >> On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Jacques Le Roux < >> [hidden email]> wrote: >> >>> Actually it's just a matter of convention and we chose this one >>> http://java.sun.com/docs/codeconv/html/CodeConventions.doc3.html#313 >>> >>> The intention is to get rid of most of all these comments and changes we >>> have to do as commiters... >>> >>> Patch ahead : 800 KB, 14574 lines (not the bigger I did, changing licence >>> headers was twice bigger) >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> From: "Jeroen van der Wal" <[hidden email]> >>> >>> Sorry for my late response, I've been away from a pc for a couple of days. >>>> We've had debates about tabs versus spaces several times and this quote >>>> reflects my opinion: >>>> >>>> "The debate over whether to use tab characters or spaces for indenting >>>> code >>>> is probably as old as Fortran. In fact, the arguing over this topic has >>>> led >>>> to many a newsgroup and mailing-list flame war, many whose intensity far >>>> surpass any Saturday night Quake Area session your thirteen brother ever >>>> saw. >>>> Well, I'm here to set the record straight on why tabs are a better choice. >>>> Like good object oriented design, it's simply a matter of recognizing the >>>> correct abstractions and encapsulating them appropriately... >>>> >>>> A tab in this context represents a unit of indentation, which should be >>>> separate from the "physical" size of the representation of that unit (on >>>> the >>>> screen). I happen to set all my editors to render that unit as equivalent >>>> to >>>> 4 spaces on the screen (even though the file only knows there is one unit >>>> of >>>> indentation, the tab character), but you may set your editor to render it >>>> as >>>> 2, 4, 8, or 100 spaces - whatever floats your boat. Point is, I don't care >>>> how big you want the indentation unit to be, and you shouldn't have to >>>> care >>>> how big I want(ed) it either. Any decent editor will let you control how >>>> tabs are rendered, and should preserve them in the file regardless of how >>>> they were rendered on the screen. >>>> >>>> By always using tabs, my code always looks consistent when I write it and >>>> you can always make it the indentation as big or small you want it. What >>>> is >>>> important to the notion of a "unit of indentation" is not the size of the >>>> indents, but rather the position of statements relative to each other. >>>> Using >>>> tabs all the time preserves that property, but using spaces unnecessarily >>>> merges the notion of your or my particular visual choice with the notion >>>> of >>>> relative positioning. >>>> >>>> The more important effect of using tabs is that we abstract out the "unit >>>> of >>>> indentation" and each implement it with whatever number of "simulated" >>>> spaces we prefer. Later, if I decide my indentation unit rendering is not >>>> the right size for me, I don't have to go change a bunch of existing code >>>> to >>>> be consistent nor do you have to even know I changed my mind. >>>> Now, isn't that beautiful? I wish everyone would see this and quit using >>>> spaces to indent code and, more generally, trying to make coding standards >>>> that specify such a "personal preference" kind of thing."" >>>> >>>> So is this patch really worth the trouble? >>>> >>>> -Jeroen >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:08 AM, Jacques Le Roux < >>>> [hidden email]> wrote: >>>> >>>> If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no >>>>> functionnal change. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>>> >>>>> I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have >>>>>> been >>>>>> merged >>>>>> >>>>>> Jacques >>>>>> >>>>>> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>>>>> >>>>>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some >>>>>>> days. >>>>>>> It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> +1 >>>>>>>> :) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace >>>>>>>>> all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in >>>>>>>>> them... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from >>>>>>>>> outside... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> > |
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In reply to this post by Jacques Le Roux
Done, rev. 737003
Jacques From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> > If nobody disagree I will do that tomorrow. It will be a massive no functionnal change. > > Jacques > > From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>I will eventually do that later when the BigDecimal branch will have been merged >> >> Jacques >> >> From: "Jacques Le Roux" <[hidden email]> >>> If nobody complains, I will replace *all* tabs by 4 spaces in some days. It will be one sole big patch without any other changes >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> From: "Stephen Rufle" <[hidden email]> >>>> +1 >>>> :) >>>> >>>> Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>> Currently there are 2351 tabs in Java files. We could easily replace all of them by 4 spaces. What do you think ? >>>>> >>>>> Maybe we could do the same in XML files, there are 32 786 tabs in them... >>>>> >>>>> In FreeMarker files : only 563 tabs, in Groovy only 668 >>>>> >>>>> JavaScrip files have 242 088 of them, most js files come from outside... >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > |
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