Release 4 on the download page
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Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page?
Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? -Adrian |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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Cheers, Ruppert On Apr 16, 2010, at 7:00 PM, Adrian Crum wrote: > Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? +1 > Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? +1 - they should go. > > -Adrian > > > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Adrian Crum-2
On Apr 17, 2010, at 3:00 AM, Adrian Crum wrote:
> Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? > I agree, especially because Release 4.0 is not an official ASF release BTW have a look at the new download page, it is much cleaner now. > Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? > In my opinion we don't need all those snapshots (there are too many also for the trunk, imo). But at least a couple of snapshots for the 9.04 release branch are useful because the release branch is receiving new bug fix commits (that could induce us to release a bug fix release 9.04.1 in the future). Jacopo > -Adrian > > > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Adrian Crum-2
would 4.0 be an archive or put some other site like 3.0 is
========================= BJ Freeman http://bjfreeman.elance.com Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/16/2010 10:28 PM: > On Apr 17, 2010, at 3:00 AM, Adrian Crum wrote: > >> Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? >> > > I agree, especially because Release 4.0 is not an official ASF release > BTW have a look at the new download page, it is much cleaner now. > >> Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? >> > > In my opinion we don't need all those snapshots (there are too many also for the trunk, imo). But at least a couple of snapshots for the 9.04 release branch are useful because the release branch is receiving new bug fix commits (that could induce us to release a bug fix release 9.04.1 in the future). > > Jacopo > >> -Adrian >> >> >> >> > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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If we want to distribute it thru the ASF mirrors (and have it in the ASF release archive) we will have to officially release it (i.e. prepare the package, sign it, vote on it and publish) as we did a few days ago for the 09.04 release. I don't think it is worth of the effort but I am wide open to suggestions.
Jacopo On Apr 17, 2010, at 8:48 AM, BJ Freeman wrote: > would 4.0 be an archive or put some other site like 3.0 is > > ========================= > BJ Freeman > http://bjfreeman.elance.com > Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> > Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> > > Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist > > Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man > <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> > > > Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/16/2010 10:28 PM: >> On Apr 17, 2010, at 3:00 AM, Adrian Crum wrote: >> >>> Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? >>> >> >> I agree, especially because Release 4.0 is not an official ASF release >> BTW have a look at the new download page, it is much cleaner now. >> >>> Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? >>> >> >> In my opinion we don't need all those snapshots (there are too many also for the trunk, imo). But at least a couple of snapshots for the 9.04 release branch are useful because the release branch is receiving new bug fix commits (that could induce us to release a bug fix release 9.04.1 in the future). >> >> Jacopo >> >>> -Adrian >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by BJ Freeman
maybe post on user ml to see how many respond.
I agree a lot of work if not being used. I guess removing it give the same message as archive. ========================= BJ Freeman http://bjfreeman.elance.com Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/17/2010 12:25 AM: > If we want to distribute it thru the ASF mirrors (and have it in the ASF release archive) we will have to officially release it (i.e. prepare the package, sign it, vote on it and publish) as we did a few days ago for the 09.04 release. I don't think it is worth of the effort but I am wide open to suggestions. > > Jacopo > > On Apr 17, 2010, at 8:48 AM, BJ Freeman wrote: > >> would 4.0 be an archive or put some other site like 3.0 is >> >> ========================= >> BJ Freeman >> http://bjfreeman.elance.com >> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> >> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> >> >> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist >> >> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man >> <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> >> >> >> Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/16/2010 10:28 PM: >>> On Apr 17, 2010, at 3:00 AM, Adrian Crum wrote: >>> >>>> Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? >>>> >>> I agree, especially because Release 4.0 is not an official ASF release >>> BTW have a look at the new download page, it is much cleaner now. >>> >>>> Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? >>>> >>> In my opinion we don't need all those snapshots (there are too many also for the trunk, imo). But at least a couple of snapshots for the 9.04 release branch are useful because the release branch is receiving new bug fix commits (that could induce us to release a bug fix release 9.04.1 in the future). >>> >>> Jacopo >>> >>>> -Adrian >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we have more than one release :)
Cheers, Ruppert On Apr 17, 2010, at 8:50 AM, BJ Freeman wrote: > maybe post on user ml to see how many respond. > I agree a lot of work if not being used. > I guess removing it give the same message as archive. > > ========================= > BJ Freeman > http://bjfreeman.elance.com > Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> > Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> > > Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist > > Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man > <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> > > > Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/17/2010 12:25 AM: >> If we want to distribute it thru the ASF mirrors (and have it in the ASF release archive) we will have to officially release it (i.e. prepare the package, sign it, vote on it and publish) as we did a few days ago for the 09.04 release. I don't think it is worth of the effort but I am wide open to suggestions. >> >> Jacopo >> >> On Apr 17, 2010, at 8:48 AM, BJ Freeman wrote: >> >>> would 4.0 be an archive or put some other site like 3.0 is >>> >>> ========================= >>> BJ Freeman >>> http://bjfreeman.elance.com >>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> >>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> >>> >>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist >>> >>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man >>> <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> >>> >>> >>> Jacopo Cappellato sent the following on 4/16/2010 10:28 PM: >>>> On Apr 17, 2010, at 3:00 AM, Adrian Crum wrote: >>>> >>>>> Now that we have an official 9.04 release, and since interest in Release 4.0 has waned, should we remove Release 4.0 from the downloads page? >>>>> >>>> I agree, especially because Release 4.0 is not an official ASF release >>>> BTW have a look at the new download page, it is much cleaner now. >>>> >>>>> Also, now that we have an official 9.04 release, do we still need all of those 9.04 snapshots? >>>>> >>>> In my opinion we don't need all those snapshots (there are too many also for the trunk, imo). But at least a couple of snapshots for the 9.04 release branch are useful because the release branch is receiving new bug fix commits (that could induce us to release a bug fix release 9.04.1 in the future). >>>> >>>> Jacopo >>>> >>>>> -Adrian >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> >> > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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I hear Jacopo on it not being worth the trouble but I agree with Tim that showing more than one release is important. A related thing that releasing 4.0 signals is that we are concerned about providing long-term support for the product. Support is an important factor for decision makers evaluating OFBiz as a solution for their business.
----- "Tim Ruppert" wrote: > I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we have more than one release :) |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Adrian Crum-2
If support is important then the Phrase
"you need to upgrade to current trunk" should be evaluated. one of the things I try to keep is what commits will work with what versions. I don't have a complete list, and have non for 4.0. ========================= BJ Freeman http://bjfreeman.elance.com Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man <http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> Ean Schuessler sent the following on 4/17/2010 11:25 AM: > I hear Jacopo on it not being worth the trouble but I agree with Tim that showing more than one release is important. A related thing that releasing 4.0 signals is that we are concerned about providing long-term support for the product. Support is an important factor for decision makers evaluating OFBiz as a solution for their business. > > ----- "Tim Ruppert" wrote: >> I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we have more than one release :) > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Ean Schuessler
On Apr 17, 2010, at 8:25 PM, Ean Schuessler wrote:
> I hear Jacopo on it not being worth the trouble but I agree with Tim that showing more than one release is important. If there is enough interest I will do the necessary steps to prepare the release package and start a vote, I am not against this, but I would like to get more positive feedback before I start the process. Even if it is a bit weird to release and older release a few days after a newer has been released; but of course we will not give much visibility to this one, and I understand it is more like a paperwork. > A related thing that releasing 4.0 signals is that we are concerned about providing long-term support for the product. Support is an important factor for decision makers evaluating OFBiz as a solution for their business. > The only signal we can give is that we do what we can to provide to the community (final users, service providers etc...) the resources (in this case the resource is the official release package available thru mirrors) to facilitate the work of supporting older releases; but the burden to support the releases is up to the community, if there are no contributions then the releases (in term of support, docs etc...) will not be much different from trunk snapshots. It is important that we all understand that there are no (implied) promises for support, backward compatibility etc. when the PMC issues a release. It is up to the community the burden of maintaining it. Kind regards, Jacopo > ----- "Tim Ruppert" wrote: >> I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we have more than one release :) > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by BJ Freeman
----- "BJ Freeman" wrote:
> If support is important then the Phrase > "you need to upgrade to current trunk" > should be evaluated. > one of the things I try to keep is what commits will work with what > versions. Yeah, I don't think we want to have any pages that advise "upgrade your production environment to trunk". That is just going to lead to heartbreak for most people who try it. Eventually I hope we will be in the position to port stuff like these recently identified XSS attacks to older releases, much as security fixes are back-ported to older stable Debian releases. As Jacopo has identified, we don't really have the man-power to reach that goal. I still think it should be a goal and should be one of the things we suggest for new developers that want to get started working on the infrastructure. It would be a great way to learn about how things have been evolving. -- Ean Schuessler, CTO Brainfood.com [hidden email] - http://www.brainfood.com - 214-720-0700 x 315 |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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From my perspective, old versions of software are like old cars - how long are you willing to pour money into them to keep them running?
Anyone who has tried to maintain an old car will know the answer to that question. -Adrian --- On Sat, 4/17/10, Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> wrote: > From: Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> > Subject: Re: Release 4 on the download page > To: [hidden email] > Cc: [hidden email] > Date: Saturday, April 17, 2010, 10:22 PM > ----- "BJ Freeman" wrote: > > If support is important then the Phrase > > "you need to upgrade to current trunk" > > should be evaluated. > > one of the things I try to keep is what commits will > work with what > > versions. > > Yeah, I don't think we want to have any pages that advise > "upgrade your production environment to trunk". That is just > going to lead to heartbreak for most people who try it. > > Eventually I hope we will be in the position to port stuff > like these recently identified XSS attacks to older > releases, much as security fixes are back-ported to older > stable Debian releases. As Jacopo has identified, we don't > really have the man-power to reach that goal. I still think > it should be a goal and should be one of the things we > suggest for new developers that want to get started working > on the infrastructure. It would be a great way to learn > about how things have been evolving. > > -- > Ean Schuessler, CTO Brainfood.com > [hidden email] > - http://www.brainfood.com - 214-720-0700 x 315 > > > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Ean Schuessler
+1
-- Ashish Sent from my iPod On 17-Apr-2010, at 11:55 PM, Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> wrote: > I hear Jacopo on it not being worth the trouble but I agree with Tim > that showing more than one release is important. A related thing > that releasing 4.0 signals is that we are concerned about providing > long-term support for the product. Support is an important factor > for decision makers evaluating OFBiz as a solution for their business. > > ----- "Tim Ruppert" wrote: >> I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we >> have more than one release :) > |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Ean Schuessler
On Apr 18, 2010, at 7:22 AM, Ean Schuessler wrote:
> Eventually I hope we will be in the position to port stuff like these recently identified XSS attacks to older releases, much as security fixes are back-ported to older stable Debian releases. As Jacopo has identified, we don't really have the man-power to reach that goal. I still think it should be a goal and should be one of the things we suggest for new developers that want to get started working on the infrastructure. The only way it will work is the other way round: we get contributions on the releases (bug reports, bug fixes, patches, documentation, upgrade scripts, support etc...) from people *interested* in maintaining them; then we invite these contributors as committers; these new committers will be mostly focused on maintaining the release branches, will interact with the other committers etc... In this way the community will really take care of releases and we will win. Jacopo |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Ashish Vijaywargiya
Ok, there seems to be enough interest at the moment at least to start the process of offcially release (and then archive) the old 4.0 release.
I have created the release package and signatures here: http://people.apache.org/~jacopoc/dist/ Please download, build, test and also verify the signatures. We may start a formal vote soon if there aren't objections. Kind regards, Jacopo On Apr 18, 2010, at 11:28 AM, Ashish Vijaywargiya wrote: > +1 > > -- > Ashish > Sent from my iPod > > On 17-Apr-2010, at 11:55 PM, Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> I hear Jacopo on it not being worth the trouble but I agree with Tim that showing more than one release is important. A related thing that releasing 4.0 signals is that we are concerned about providing long-term support for the product. Support is an important factor for decision makers evaluating OFBiz as a solution for their business. >> >> ----- "Tim Ruppert" wrote: >>> I'd say let's do the same with 4.0 release - it then shows that we have more than one release :) >> |
Re: Release 4 on the download page
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In reply to this post by Adrian Crum-2
I usually think of software as the opposite of things like cars... the longer a piece of software lives the more the software itself gets complex and is more difficult it is to support and maintain. Fortunately older software doesn't wear out and break down like physical things do. The difference is the number of people interested in maintaining it, and ultimately (IMO) that's all that matters with software: how many people are interested in it? How much can you share the cost of maintenance with others? With release4.0 there may be lots of people using it an interested in it, but no one would know since there isn't much activity reporting bugs and contributing patches in that branch... ;) -David On Apr 18, 2010, at 12:56 AM, Adrian Crum wrote: > From my perspective, old versions of software are like old cars - how long are you willing to pour money into them to keep them running? > > Anyone who has tried to maintain an old car will know the answer to that question. > > -Adrian > > > --- On Sat, 4/17/10, Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> From: Ean Schuessler <[hidden email]> >> Subject: Re: Release 4 on the download page >> To: [hidden email] >> Cc: [hidden email] >> Date: Saturday, April 17, 2010, 10:22 PM >> ----- "BJ Freeman" wrote: >>> If support is important then the Phrase >>> "you need to upgrade to current trunk" >>> should be evaluated. >>> one of the things I try to keep is what commits will >> work with what >>> versions. >> >> Yeah, I don't think we want to have any pages that advise >> "upgrade your production environment to trunk". That is just >> going to lead to heartbreak for most people who try it. >> >> Eventually I hope we will be in the position to port stuff >> like these recently identified XSS attacks to older >> releases, much as security fixes are back-ported to older >> stable Debian releases. As Jacopo has identified, we don't >> really have the man-power to reach that goal. I still think >> it should be a goal and should be one of the things we >> suggest for new developers that want to get started working >> on the infrastructure. It would be a great way to learn >> about how things have been evolving. >> >> -- >> Ean Schuessler, CTO Brainfood.com >> [hidden email] >> - http://www.brainfood.com - 214-720-0700 x 315 >> >> >> > > > |
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