We're Hiring!

[Si Chen-2]

Hey everybody -

Just wanted to remind everybody on this list that we're still looking
for more developers with some familiarity with OFBiz.  We have paid
positions for developers to work on both client projects and the
development of the opentaps Open Source ERP + CRM system and ofbiz.  
Some of the things which you'll be working on include:

- Extending business intelligence in opentaps
- Upgrading our user interfaces
- Building out our applications
- Building a comprehensive set of tests and testing procedures

You can work at your own schedule, either full-time and part-time, and
from anywhere you want.  If this is something you're interested in,
please send me an email off the list.

Thanks!

Si Chen

[David E Jones]

On Oct 9, 2007, at 5:02 PM, Si Chen wrote:

> Hey everybody -
>
> Just wanted to remind everybody on this list that we're still  
> looking for more developers with some familiarity with OFBiz.  We  
> have paid positions for developers to work on both client projects  
> and the development of the opentaps Open Source ERP + CRM system  
> and ofbiz.  Some of the things which you'll be working on include:
>
> - Extending business intelligence in opentaps
> - Upgrading our user interfaces
> - Building out our applications
> - Building a comprehensive set of tests and testing procedures
>
> You can work at your own schedule, either full-time and part-time,  
> and from anywhere you want.  If this is something you're interested  
> in, please send me an email off the list.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Si Chen

... or work at Hotwax Media or any of various other companies that  
will pay you to do the same foundational and generic work in the  
Apache 2 licensed OFBiz instead of the HPL licensed opentaps. Not  
only will your work have visibility in a larger community, but you  
can use your work in your next job without encumberances, even if  
that next job is your own company where you want to create build  
solutions, even commercial ones, based on OFBiz.

Not to say there is anything wrong or bad with what Open Source  
Strategies is doing (it's great to have their participation in  
OFBiz!), but just pointing this out so that those listening in  
realize there are other equally valid alternatives.

-David

[SkipDever]

David

This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where you have
expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several times
and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use clauses in
some).

While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather aggrevated when
people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial enterprises
and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.

Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable with in
case I have missed some lawyer stuff?

Skip

[BJ Freeman]

I will share what little I know for past discussions
i am sure David will respond with his own.
if a person is working for a company they would have to share the code.
most companies consider it intellectual property they paid for and do
not want to share it.
so a project that is has a license that says any code used commercially
must be put back in the project would stifle the project.

This is fine for developers like you and I that don't mind contributing.
but even some developers want to guarantee that their work have some
reward other than just sharing their work.


skip@theDevers sent the following on 10/12/2007 9:12 AM:

> David
>
> This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where you have
> expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several times
> and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use clauses in
> some).
>
> While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather aggrevated when
> people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial enterprises
> and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.
>
> Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable with in
> case I have missed some lawyer stuff?
>
> Skip
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

[cjhowe]

This is only my view.  I certainly support anyone's right to release their work under whatever license they deem most beneficial to themselves and Open Source Strategies has been very generous in giving back to the OFBiz community, this is not a knock on them, simply the license.  In regards to HPL and GPL, without getting into the specifics of each, most projects are kind of  hypocritical with their stance on parasites.  Almost without exception HPL and GPL licensed projects are born out of a project with a BSD/MIT/Apache license.  By releasing their modifications to those projects under GPL or HPL, they're saying "we reserve the right to be parasites to those projects, but won't allow others to be parasites to ours".  

As I understand it, while there is not a "no commercial use clause" in the HPL, the effect is of one.  If you're running a website and the website's code is HPL, then you're under obligation to release the source of your website, even your modifications.  If that is the case, your website is severely limited in its ability to be a competitive advantage.  No competitive advantage, might as well be no commercial use.

----- Original Message ----
From: "skip@theDevers" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 11:12:58 AM
Subject: RE: We're Hiring!

David

This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where you have
expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several times
and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use clauses in
some).

While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather aggrevated when
people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial enterprises
and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.

Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable with in
case I have missed some lawyer stuff?

Skip

[Shi Jinghai]

Hi David,

I can understand your feeling, the more you love, the more severelly you
criticize (in Chinese, 爱之深, 责之切). And I agree with you.

> Not to say there is anything wrong or bad with what Open Source  
> Strategies is doing (it's great to have their participation in  
> OFBiz!), but just pointing this out so that those listening in  
> realize there are other equally valid alternatives.
BTW, as OFBiz has been TLP of Apache, could you start to select some sub
projects in OFBiz? Such as OFBiz CRM, OFBiz-CMS bridge, OFBiz-SSO and
etc.

I think it's time to plant some seeds in OFBiz garden and encourage them
to grow, do you?

Regards,

Shi Jinghai/Beijing Langhua Ltd.

[SkipDever]

Chris

Nicely put.  I had not considered the competitive advantage thing and you
are absolutely right.  The project I am working on now will have a unique
website that I hope will give my customer that advantage you speak of and
giving away the source would not be reasonable even for money.

As far as parasites, a person who contributes back to the project is not one
in my view.  That's what gives open source the gas to move ahead.  By saying
that this modification or that addition to an existing project is my work
and I deserve some recompense for it ignores value of the work that someone
else did.  I am not saying that you have to give everything you do back to
the community.

What I am saying is, if you use opensource software, you have a moral
obligation to contribute SOMETHING back.  Then you cease to be a parasite
and become part of the organism.

As far as Open Source Strategies goes, I fully understand their need to have
their own project.  There is this ofbiz groupware bureaucracy (is that
spelled right?) to get anything done and it is time consuming.  For me, I
fully expect to offer my contributions on a private website on a take it or
leave it basis so I don't have to deal with it.

Skip



-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Howe [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:48 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: We're Hiring!


This is only my view.  I certainly support anyone's right to release their
work under whatever license they deem most beneficial to themselves and Open
Source Strategies has been very generous in giving back to the OFBiz
community, this is not a knock on them, simply the license.  In regards to
HPL and GPL, without getting into the specifics of each, most projects are
kind of  hypocritical with their stance on parasites.  Almost without
exception HPL and GPL licensed projects are born out of a project with a
BSD/MIT/Apache license.  By releasing their modifications to those projects
under GPL or HPL, they're saying "we reserve the right to be parasites to
those projects, but won't allow others to be parasites to ours".

As I understand it, while there is not a "no commercial use clause" in the
HPL, the effect is of one.  If you're running a website and the website's
code is HPL, then you're under obligation to release the source of your
website, even your modifications.  If that is the case, your website is
severely limited in its ability to be a competitive advantage.  No
competitive advantage, might as well be no commercial use.

----- Original Message ----
From: "skip@theDevers" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 11:12:58 AM
Subject: RE: We're Hiring!

David

This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where you have
expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several times
and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use clauses in
some).

While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather aggrevated when
people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial enterprises
and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.

Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable with in
case I have missed some lawyer stuff?

Skip

[cjhowe]

Skip
The moral obligation that you speak of brings up two additional problems with HPL/GPL.  One, the moral obligation becomes a legal obligation, and two, it's not that you give _something back, but that you're obligated to give _everything back (not specifically to that project, but to the open source community at large).  That seems like a dangerous position to take when talking specifically of software that drives businesses.

As far as how you offer your contributions, feel free to do so any way you wish.  However, consider what your intention is in your contribution.  The manner you suggest benefits very few, and more specifically may not be beneficial to the OFBiz community, for which you are saying that you specifically are not wanting to be a parasite to.  If your intention is to benefit the OFBiz community, to cover as many bases as possible, consider at a minimum to offer your contribution to JIRA, even if it's not likely to be added into the project itself. In my opinion, offering it to JIRA, you're being clear that it is your work and that you are offering it under the Apache license (others may certainly disagree with that opinion).

----- Original Message ----
From: "skip@theDevers" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 12:57:37 PM
Subject: RE: We're Hiring!

Chris

Nicely put.  I had not considered the competitive advantage thing and you
are absolutely right.  The project I am working on now will have a unique
website that I hope will give my customer that advantage you speak of and
giving away the source would not be reasonable even for money.

As far as parasites, a person who contributes back to the project is not one
in my view.  That's what gives open source the gas to move ahead.  By saying
that this modification or that addition to an existing project is my work
and I deserve some recompense for it ignores value of the work that someone
else did.  I am not saying that you have to give everything you do back to
the community.

What I am saying is, if you use opensource software, you have a moral
obligation to contribute SOMETHING back.  Then you cease to be a parasite
and become part of the organism.

As far as Open Source Strategies goes, I fully understand their need to have
their own project.  There is this ofbiz groupware bureaucracy (is that
spelled right?) to get anything done and it is time consuming.  For me, I
fully expect to offer my contributions on a private website on a take it or
leave it basis so I don't have to deal with it.

Skip



-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Howe [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:48 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: We're Hiring!


This is only my view.  I certainly support anyone's right to release their
work under whatever license they deem most beneficial to themselves and Open
Source Strategies has been very generous in giving back to the OFBiz
community, this is not a knock on them, simply the license.  In regards to
HPL and GPL, without getting into the specifics of each, most projects are
kind of  hypocritical with their stance on parasites.  Almost without
exception HPL and GPL licensed projects are born out of a project with a
BSD/MIT/Apache license.  By releasing their modifications to those projects
under GPL or HPL, they're saying "we reserve the right to be parasites to
those projects, but won't allow others to be parasites to ours".

As I understand it, while there is not a "no commercial use clause" in the
HPL, the effect is of one.  If you're running a website and the website's
code is HPL, then you're under obligation to release the source of your
website, even your modifications.  If that is the case, your website is
severely limited in its ability to be a competitive advantage.  No
competitive advantage, might as well be no commercial use.

----- Original Message ----
From: "skip@theDevers" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 11:12:58 AM
Subject: RE: We're Hiring!

David

This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where you have
expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several times
and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use clauses in
some).

While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather aggrevated when
people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial enterprises
and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.

Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable with in
case I have missed some lawyer stuff?

Skip

[David E Jones]

On Oct 12, 2007, at 11:24 AM, Shi Jinghai wrote:

> BTW, as OFBiz has been TLP of Apache, could you start to select  
> some sub
> projects in OFBiz? Such as OFBiz CRM, OFBiz-CMS bridge, OFBiz-SSO and
> etc.
>
> I think it's time to plant some seeds in OFBiz garden and encourage  
> them
> to grow, do you?

We have discussed creating separate projects for these sorts of  
things, but we just don't have enough management bandwidth with the  
current volunteers to handle the overhead of creating all of these  
different projects with different infrastructure and such.

Sooner or later we'll definitely get there and probably even split  
out the framework and applications as separate projects. Actually  
right now we have the directory tree structured to prepare for this,  
and there would be a sub-project for each of the following:

- ofbiz/framework (along with ofbiz/runtime)
- ofbiz/applications
- each directory under: ofbiz/specialpurpose

Right now we are maintaining strict one-way dependencies between  
these. In other words the framework can run without applications, and  
the framework and applications are totally independent of any of the  
specialpurpose applications.

-David

[David E Jones]

On Oct 12, 2007, at 10:12 AM, skip@theDevers wrote:

> David
>
> This is the second refence to the HPL in the last few days where  
> you have
> expressed your unhappiness with it.  I have read it through several  
> times
> and can find nothing onerous in it (unlike the no commercial use  
> clauses in
> some).
>
> While I find the Apache license ideal, I myself get rather  
> aggrevated when
> people use this Apache Licensed software for their commercial  
> enterprises
> and never contribute anything back. I consider them to be parasites.
>
> Anyway, can you describe specifically what you are not comfortable  
> with in
> case I have missed some lawyer stuff?

Chris Howe described this fairly well. To add to what he said related  
to the onerous nature of the HPL:

1. it is not an OSI (opensource.org) approved license, for many that  
means it is NOT "open source"

2. in addition to the copy-left annoyance that Chris described and  
that is well known because of the GPL licenses, the HPL very clearly  
adds on a constraint that software made available over the internet  
IS making it available publicly (which is unclear, and often argued  
against for the GPL); that means that if you write ecommerce software  
based on HPL licensed stuff, you have to release even your templates  
and everything under HPL; also to make this more fun it is common  
that configuration files and seed and other data files are also HPL  
licensed, which means technically you HAVE TO release you  
configuration changes under the HPL (or buy a commercial license to  
avoid it all...), and that can include account names and passwords  
and encryption keys and all sorts of other things that are not just  
trade secrets but security holes

In other words, it's a mess, and I think only those who have not  
really though through the implications for the business software  
industry would think of it as okay and low risk to use.

So yeah, that's why I don't like GPL or anything like it (especially  
not HPL) for an open source project like OFBiz. The only reason most  
groups want to use it is because they are companies and not  
communities, and they want to market as open source but still have a  
software licensing revenue. For OFBiz I have always wanted it to be a  
community-driven project, and being in the ASF now really helps us  
all do the more successfully.

-David

[David E Jones]

On Oct 12, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Chris Howe wrote:

> As far as how you offer your contributions, feel free to do so any  
> way you wish.  However, consider what your intention is in your  
> contribution.  The manner you suggest benefits very few, and more  
> specifically may not be beneficial to the OFBiz community, for  
> which you are saying that you specifically are not wanting to be a  
> parasite to.  If your intention is to benefit the OFBiz community,  
> to cover as many bases as possible, consider at a minimum to offer  
> your contribution to JIRA, even if it's not likely to be added into  
> the project itself. In my opinion, offering it to JIRA, you're  
> being clear that it is your work and that you are offering it under  
> the Apache license (others may certainly disagree with that opinion).

Yes, this is true. Unless the software is explicitly contributed to  
OFBiz (most easily done through Jira) it can NOT go into the project.  
Ie if someone creates an add on component and drops it on  
SourceForge, and even licenses it under Apache 2.0, we can't touch  
and it is not legal to bring it into the project.

-David

[SkipDever]

David and Chris

Thank you both for the clarifications on this issue.  I think the
distinction between a moral obligation and a legal one is particularly
compelling as well as giving ALL work and SOME work back.

Thanks also for the JIRA method of offering contributions.  That is exactly
what I'll do because I hope that it will benefit the most this way (although
I still expect to offer it through a private website just to make it more
publically visible).

It is my thinking that a website offering Ofbiz addons that are industry
specific and therefore have no place in the Ofbiz code base is a useful
thing.

Skip

[Shi Jinghai]

> Yes, this is true. Unless the software is explicitly contributed to  
> OFBiz (most easily done through Jira) it can NOT go into the project.  
> Ie if someone creates an add on component and drops it on  
> SourceForge, and even licenses it under Apache 2.0, we can't touch  
> and it is not legal to bring it into the project.

Sounds we are also doing sth wrong.^_^

You are right. We'll contribute a rmi client of OFBiz and a jBPM
workflow component to OFBiz Jira as soon as we complete the testing on
4.0 branch.

Shi Jinghai/Beijing Langhua Ltd.

[Adrian Crum]

Chris Howe wrote:
> As far as how you offer your contributions, feel free to do so any way you wish.  However, consider what your intention is in your contribution.  The manner you suggest benefits very few, and more specifically may not be beneficial to the OFBiz community, for which you are saying that you specifically are not wanting to be a parasite to.  If your intention is to benefit the OFBiz community, to cover as many bases as possible, consider at a minimum to offer your contribution to JIRA, even if it's not likely to be added into the project itself. In my opinion, offering it to JIRA, you're being clear that it is your work and that you are offering it under the Apache license (others may certainly disagree with that opinion).

I'd like to second what Chris suggested. I have contributed enhancements to Jira that, for one
reason or another, weren't deemed acceptable for inclusion in the project. I keep those
contributions updated against the latest SVN so that others can use them. Who knows, maybe in time
there will be enough interest to get them included. In the meantime they're readily accessible to
the OFBiz community.

-Adrian

[SkipDever]

Vijay

I have two hosted websites that I currently do not use one with almost 5
gigs on it (more if I clean out some old stuff) and another with 90gigs that
I was just about to drop.  Bandwidth is not a problem at 250gigs a month on
the small one and 1000gigs on the larger and even when they were active with
hundreds of users, I never even approached 25% of that.

Database space (mysql) is unlimited as far as I know.

I just won't have time for a few weeks to get it set up to accept
submissions.

My intent was to take anything from anyone, and then download it to a local
isolated machine and make sure there wasn't anything malicious in it, then
put it back up for others to grab.

The problem here is the regular maintenance checking new submissions.  I can
devote some time to that, but not lots.

If someone has time to do a php page to accept submissions, I can set up
phpBB pretty fast and a home page and then give someone ftp access to work
on the submissions page(s).

I just checked and ofbizdev.org is available for a domain name.

Skip

[BJ Freeman]

not sure what you envision.
there should be only one official svn for Apache ofbiz.
and there are some others the provide demos along with their add-ons
If you have something to demo or just provide another demo site, that
may be helpful


skip@theDevers sent the following on 10/12/2007 4:46 PM:

> Vijay
>
> I have two hosted websites that I currently do not use one with almost 5
> gigs on it (more if I clean out some old stuff) and another with 90gigs that
> I was just about to drop.  Bandwidth is not a problem at 250gigs a month on
> the small one and 1000gigs on the larger and even when they were active with
> hundreds of users, I never even approached 25% of that.
>
> Database space (mysql) is unlimited as far as I know.
>
> I just won't have time for a few weeks to get it set up to accept
> submissions.
>
> My intent was to take anything from anyone, and then download it to a local
> isolated machine and make sure there wasn't anything malicious in it, then
> put it back up for others to grab.
>
> The problem here is the regular maintenance checking new submissions.  I can
> devote some time to that, but not lots.
>
> If someone has time to do a php page to accept submissions, I can set up
> phpBB pretty fast and a home page and then give someone ftp access to work
> on the submissions page(s).
>
> I just checked and ofbizdev.org is available for a domain name.
>
> Skip
>
>
>
>
>

[SkipDever]

BJ

This not a demo site.  It is a developers site to collect Ofbiz addons and
customizations that don't make it into the official Ofbiz release for one
reason or another.  I know of two people now who cannot post to Jira because
of licensing issues.  There are many other reasons.  Maybe it's not "best
practice" or industry specific or whatever.  Maybe they don't have time to
continue updating it for the latest Ofbiz release.  There are dozens of
reasons people feel uncomfortable offering code back.

This is just a place to let Ofbiz developers contribute back the community
with no strings and little oversite.  Anything that can go in Jira should go
there if people want to give that a try.

The intent is to provide something that is easy to use so you can steal some
code or documentation to help you with your next project when it doesnt fit
the Ofbiz model as well as you would like (which I expect is almost always)
or it's in an industry that is not well supported.

This is not part of Ofbiz although in my vision, I would hope that whatever
can, would have been offered via Jira.

There would be no SVN here, just tarred or zipped bits of code or
documententation completely under control of the author and only vetted for
malicious code.

The only thing I would like to see is that if you take something, you have
to give something back.  Maybe you give something BEFORE you take something.

There are already several demo sites around, so I think that is a little
redundant.

Anyway, only a dream until I have a few days to spend on it.

Skip

-----Original Message-----
From: BJ Freeman [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 7:41 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Developers Website


not sure what you envision.
there should be only one official svn for Apache ofbiz.
and there are some others the provide demos along with their add-ons
If you have something to demo or just provide another demo site, that
may be helpful


skip@theDevers sent the following on 10/12/2007 4:46 PM:
> Vijay
>
> I have two hosted websites that I currently do not use one with almost 5
> gigs on it (more if I clean out some old stuff) and another with 90gigs
that
> I was just about to drop.  Bandwidth is not a problem at 250gigs a month
on
> the small one and 1000gigs on the larger and even when they were active
with
> hundreds of users, I never even approached 25% of that.
>
> Database space (mysql) is unlimited as far as I know.
>
> I just won't have time for a few weeks to get it set up to accept
> submissions.
>
> My intent was to take anything from anyone, and then download it to a
local
> isolated machine and make sure there wasn't anything malicious in it, then
> put it back up for others to grab.
>
> The problem here is the regular maintenance checking new submissions.  I
can

> devote some time to that, but not lots.
>
> If someone has time to do a php page to accept submissions, I can set up
> phpBB pretty fast and a home page and then give someone ftp access to work
> on the submissions page(s).
>
> I just checked and ofbizdev.org is available for a domain name.
>
> Skip
>
>
>
>
>

[BJ Freeman]

Ok.
I have a setup on sourceforge for that.
might consider that.


skip@theDevers sent the following on 10/12/2007 10:33 PM:

> BJ
>
> This not a demo site.  It is a developers site to collect Ofbiz addons and
> customizations that don't make it into the official Ofbiz release for one
> reason or another.  I know of two people now who cannot post to Jira because
> of licensing issues.  There are many other reasons.  Maybe it's not "best
> practice" or industry specific or whatever.  Maybe they don't have time to
> continue updating it for the latest Ofbiz release.  There are dozens of
> reasons people feel uncomfortable offering code back.
>
> This is just a place to let Ofbiz developers contribute back the community
> with no strings and little oversite.  Anything that can go in Jira should go
> there if people want to give that a try.
>
> The intent is to provide something that is easy to use so you can steal some
> code or documentation to help you with your next project when it doesnt fit
> the Ofbiz model as well as you would like (which I expect is almost always)
> or it's in an industry that is not well supported.
>
> This is not part of Ofbiz although in my vision, I would hope that whatever
> can, would have been offered via Jira.
>
> There would be no SVN here, just tarred or zipped bits of code or
> documententation completely under control of the author and only vetted for
> malicious code.
>
> The only thing I would like to see is that if you take something, you have
> to give something back.  Maybe you give something BEFORE you take something.
>
> There are already several demo sites around, so I think that is a little
> redundant.
>
> Anyway, only a dream until I have a few days to spend on it.
>
> Skip
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BJ Freeman [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 7:41 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: Developers Website
>
>
> not sure what you envision.
> there should be only one official svn for Apache ofbiz.
> and there are some others the provide demos along with their add-ons
> If you have something to demo or just provide another demo site, that
> may be helpful
>
>
> skip@theDevers sent the following on 10/12/2007 4:46 PM:
>> Vijay
>>
>> I have two hosted websites that I currently do not use one with almost 5
>> gigs on it (more if I clean out some old stuff) and another with 90gigs
> that
>> I was just about to drop.  Bandwidth is not a problem at 250gigs a month
> on
>> the small one and 1000gigs on the larger and even when they were active
> with
>> hundreds of users, I never even approached 25% of that.
>>
>> Database space (mysql) is unlimited as far as I know.
>>
>> I just won't have time for a few weeks to get it set up to accept
>> submissions.
>>
>> My intent was to take anything from anyone, and then download it to a
> local
>> isolated machine and make sure there wasn't anything malicious in it, then
>> put it back up for others to grab.
>>
>> The problem here is the regular maintenance checking new submissions.  I
> can
>> devote some time to that, but not lots.
>>
>> If someone has time to do a php page to accept submissions, I can set up
>> phpBB pretty fast and a home page and then give someone ftp access to work
>> on the submissions page(s).
>>
>> I just checked and ofbizdev.org is available for a domain name.
>>
>> Skip
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

[Jacopo Cappellato]

Hi Skip,

skip@theDevers wrote:
> ...
> The intent is to provide something that is easy to use so you can steal some
> code or documentation to help you with your next project when it doesnt fit
> the Ofbiz model as well as you would like (which I expect is almost always)
> or it's in an industry that is not well supported.
>

I don't understand... under what license are you going to collect the
contributions? No license from the authors == no rights to use.

> This is not part of Ofbiz although in my vision, I would hope that whatever
> can, would have been offered via Jira.
>

The author of a contribution in Apache OFBiz Jira have to choose to
release it under the ASL2.0 or not (there is a radio box for this when
you create an attachment); the patches/contributions in Jira are never
deleted, even if they are not committed in the OFBiz svn... and of
course they can be downloaded and evaluated by people interested.

Isn't this enough?

Jacopo

[Jacques Le Roux]

Just a reminder to endorse Jacopo's opinion :

Joint work :
"For copyright purposes, a collaboration between two or more authors in which their contributions are joined into a single cohesive
work. Each author of a joint work has equal rights to register and enforce the copyright, regardless of how their shares in the work
are divided. "

http://www.nolo.com/definition.cfm/Term/D02E1468-485C-4B29-9A6F9698BE4A5433/alpha/J/

This is why Jira issue have this check boxe : ASF Grant. And this is why ASF and its practices exist.

We had an extended discussion about this topic earlier this year or last year you might find it thru Nabble.

Jacques

De : "Jacopo Cappellato" <[hidden email]>

> Hi Skip,
>
> skip@theDevers wrote:
> > ...
> > The intent is to provide something that is easy to use so you can steal some
> > code or documentation to help you with your next project when it doesnt fit
> > the Ofbiz model as well as you would like (which I expect is almost always)
> > or it's in an industry that is not well supported.
> >
>
> I don't understand... under what license are you going to collect the
> contributions? No license from the authors == no rights to use.
>
> > This is not part of Ofbiz although in my vision, I would hope that whatever
> > can, would have been offered via Jira.
> >
>
> The author of a contribution in Apache OFBiz Jira have to choose to
> release it under the ASL2.0 or not (there is a radio box for this when
> you create an attachment); the patches/contributions in Jira are never
> deleted, even if they are not committed in the OFBiz svn... and of
> course they can be downloaded and evaluated by people interested.
>
> Isn't this enough?
>
> Jacopo
>