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Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

accounting

Hello,

About accounting:

a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
another country for example?
b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
ofbiz?
c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
journal and a bank journal?

thanks,

Heidi

c.schinzer

Re: accounting

I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like to
understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses what
needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.

And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should be
structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most commercial
accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.

So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.

I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the WIKI:
http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz

Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc is
W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.

Regards

Carsten

2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>

> Hello,
>
> About accounting:
>
> a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
> another country for example?
> b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
> ofbiz?
> c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
> journal and a bank journal?
>
> thanks,
>
> Heidi
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

BJ Freeman

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

There are a couple that are very knowledgeable about this.
here is what I know.
in the demo data that loads you can use that as a model to make you own GL.
the ledgers you call out are functional another way and are not called
by those names.

Info Olagos sent the following on 1/13/2010 5:03 AM:

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by c.schinzer

Hello Karsten,

Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
Germany.

Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.

That is a first step, i think.

PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.

regards,
Heidi

2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>

> I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like to
> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
> what
> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>
> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should be
> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most commercial
> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>
> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.
>
> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the WIKI:
>
> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>
> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc
> is
> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > About accounting:
> >
> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
> > another country for example?
> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
> > ofbiz?
> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
> > journal and a bank journal?
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Heidi
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Best
>
> Carsten Schinzer
>
> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> 80637 München
> Germany
>

Jacques Le Roux

Re: accounting

Administrator

If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
implementation for SME (TerCompta)
Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?

Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your document. I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?

Jacques

From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
Hello Karsten,

Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
Germany.

Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.

That is a first step, i think.

PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.

regards,
Heidi

2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

Bonjour Jacques,

I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
same, but it is the first task i want to perform.

Bien à vous,
Heidi

2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>

> If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
> already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
> implementation for SME (TerCompta)
> Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
> I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
>
> Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your document.
> I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
>
> Jacques
>
> From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
>
> Hello Karsten,
>
> Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
> I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
> you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
> But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
> Germany.
>
> Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
> So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
>
> That is a first step, i think.
>
> PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
>
> regards,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>
> I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like to
>> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
>> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
>> what
>> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>>
>> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
>> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should be
>> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
>> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
>> commercial
>> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>>
>> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.
>>
>> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the WIKI:
>>
>>
>> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>>
>> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
>> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc
>> is
>> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>> Carsten
>>
>>
>> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>>
>> > Hello,
>> >
>> > About accounting:
>> >
>> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
>> > another country for example?
>> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
>> > ofbiz?
>> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
>> > journal and a bank journal?
>> >
>> > thanks,
>> >
>> > Heidi
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Best
>>
>> Carsten Schinzer
>>
>> Waisenhausstr. 53a
>> 80637 München
>> Germany
>>
>>
>
>

Jeroen van der Wal-2

Re: accounting

These links will provide an insight different Chart of Accounts. I
know for a fact that companies in UK, Netherlands, Italy and
Switserland can choose their own chart of accounts.
http://wiki.openbravo.com/wiki/Localization_Downloads
http://doc.openerp.com/technical_guide/l10n_chart_be_frnl.html?highlight=l10n_chart#module-l10n_chart_be_frnl

Jeroen van der Wal

On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:47 PM, Info Olagos <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Bonjour Jacques,
>
> I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
> same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
>
> Bien à vous,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>
>> If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
>> already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
>> implementation for SME (TerCompta)
>> Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
>> I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
>>
>> Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your document.
>> I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
>>
>> Jacques
>>
>> From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
>>
>> Hello Karsten,
>>
>> Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
>> I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
>> you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
>> But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
>> Germany.
>>
>> Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
>> So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
>>
>> That is a first step, i think.
>>
>> PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
>>
>> regards,
>> Heidi
>>
>> 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>>
>> I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like to
>>> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
>>> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
>>> what
>>> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>>>
>>> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
>>> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should be
>>> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
>>> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
>>> commercial
>>> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>>>
>>> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.
>>>
>>> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the WIKI:
>>>
>>>
>>> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>>>
>>> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
>>> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc
>>> is
>>> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>>
>>> Carsten
>>>
>>>
>>> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> > Hello,
>>> >
>>> > About accounting:
>>> >
>>> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
>>> > another country for example?
>>> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
>>> > ofbiz?
>>> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
>>> > journal and a bank journal?
>>> >
>>> > thanks,
>>> >
>>> > Heidi
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Best
>>>
>>> Carsten Schinzer
>>>
>>> Waisenhausstr. 53a
>>> 80637 München
>>> Germany
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>

c.schinzer

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Hi Heidi,

Legislation on Finance Report structure in DE:
* Handels-Gesetzbuch (HGB) Paragraph 266
For larger Organisations:
* Bilanz Richtlinien Gesetz (BiRiLiG)

If you search for either term on google.de you will find good results.

I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure as
XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for improvement
and attach stuff there.

Regards

Carsten

2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>

> Bonjour Jacques,
>
> I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
> same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
>
> Bien à vous,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>
> > If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
> > already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
> > implementation for SME (TerCompta)
> > Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
> > I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
> >
> > Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your
> document.
> > I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
> >
> > Jacques
> >
> > From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
> >
> > Hello Karsten,
> >
> > Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
> > I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think
> as
> > you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
> > But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
> > Germany.
> >
> > Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
> > So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
> >
> > That is a first step, i think.
> >
> > PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
> >
> > regards,
> > Heidi
> >
> > 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
> >
> > I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like
> to
> >> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
> >> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
> >> what
> >> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
> >>
> >> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany.
> E.g.
> >> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should
> be
> >> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market
> which
> >> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
> >> commercial
> >> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
> >>
> >> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this
> matter.
> >>
> >> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the
> WIKI:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
> >>
> >> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
> >> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the
> doc
> >> is
> >> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >>
> >> Carsten
> >>
> >>
> >> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
> >>
> >> > Hello,
> >> >
> >> > About accounting:
> >> >
> >> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
> >> > another country for example?
> >> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
> >> > ofbiz?
> >> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a
> buy
> >> > journal and a bank journal?
> >> >
> >> > thanks,
> >> >
> >> > Heidi
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Best
> >>
> >> Carsten Schinzer
> >>
> >> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> >> 80637 München
> >> Germany
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

Hello Karsten,

Thanks for information.

I have found myself a chart of accounts for Germany and i see it is
completely different from that used in Belgium. Especially the numbers of
the accounts are completely differently choosen.

Perhaps you can send here already the ofbiz config artifact so i have an
idea what it is exactly .

I didn't read already the HGB but saw it online via Google.
regards,
Heidi
2010/1/14 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>

> Hi Heidi,
>
> Legislation on Finance Report structure in DE:
> * Handels-Gesetzbuch (HGB) Paragraph 266
> For larger Organisations:
> * Bilanz Richtlinien Gesetz (BiRiLiG)
>
> If you search for either term on google.de you will find good results.
>
> I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure as
> XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for improvement
> and attach stuff there.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>
> > Bonjour Jacques,
> >
> > I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
> > same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
> >
> > Bien à vous,
> > Heidi
> >
> > 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
> >
> > > If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
> > > already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
> > > implementation for SME (TerCompta)
> > > Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for
> Italia...
> > > I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
> > >
> > > Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your
> > document.
> > > I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
> > >
> > > Jacques
> > >
> > > From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
> > >
> > > Hello Karsten,
> > >
> > > Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
> > > I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think
> > as
> > > you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
> > > But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
> > > Germany.
> > >
> > > Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
> > > So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
> > >
> > > That is a first step, i think.
> > >
> > > PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
> > >
> > > regards,
> > > Heidi
> > >
> > > 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
> > >
> > > I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also
> like
> > to
> > >> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
> > >> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset
> assesses
> > >> what
> > >> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
> > >>
> > >> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany.
> > E.g.
> > >> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet
> should
> > be
> > >> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market
> > which
> > >> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
> > >> commercial
> > >> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
> > >>
> > >> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this
> > matter.
> > >>
> > >> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the
> > WIKI:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
> > >>
> > >> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
> > >> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the
> > doc
> > >> is
> > >> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
> > >>
> > >> Regards
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Carsten
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
> > >>
> > >> > Hello,
> > >> >
> > >> > About accounting:
> > >> >
> > >> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used
> in
> > >> > another country for example?
> > >> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium
> in
> > >> > ofbiz?
> > >> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a
> > buy
> > >> > journal and a bank journal?
> > >> >
> > >> > thanks,
> > >> >
> > >> > Heidi
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >>
> > >> Best
> > >>
> > >> Carsten Schinzer
> > >>
> > >> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> > >> 80637 München
> > >> Germany
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Best
>
> Carsten Schinzer
>
> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> 80637 München
> Germany
>

Jacques Le Roux

Re: accounting

Administrator

In reply to this post by c.schinzer

Hi Carsten,

Yes a Jira seems appropriate.

Thanks

Jacques

From: "Carsten Schinzer" <[hidden email]>
Hi Heidi,

Legislation on Finance Report structure in DE:
* Handels-Gesetzbuch (HGB) Paragraph 266
For larger Organisations:
* Bilanz Richtlinien Gesetz (BiRiLiG)

If you search for either term on google.de you will find good results.

I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure as
XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for improvement
and attach stuff there.

Regards

Carsten

2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>

> Bonjour Jacques,
>
> I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
> same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
>
> Bien à vous,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>
> > If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
> > already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
> > implementation for SME (TerCompta)
> > Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
> > I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
> >
> > Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your
> document.
> > I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
> >
> > Jacques
> >
> > From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
> >
> > Hello Karsten,
> >
> > Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
> > I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think
> as
> > you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
> > But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
> > Germany.
> >
> > Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
> > So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
> >
> > That is a first step, i think.
> >
> > PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
> >
> > regards,
> > Heidi
> >
> > 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
> >
> > I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like
> to
> >> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
> >> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
> >> what
> >> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
> >>
> >> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany.
> E.g.
> >> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should
> be
> >> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market
> which
> >> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
> >> commercial
> >> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
> >>
> >> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this
> matter.
> >>
> >> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the
> WIKI:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
> >>
> >> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
> >> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the
> doc
> >> is
> >> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >>
> >> Carsten
> >>
> >>
> >> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
> >>
> >> > Hello,
> >> >
> >> > About accounting:
> >> >
> >> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
> >> > another country for example?
> >> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
> >> > ofbiz?
> >> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a
> buy
> >> > journal and a bank journal?
> >> >
> >> > thanks,
> >> >
> >> > Heidi
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Best
> >>
> >> Carsten Schinzer
> >>
> >> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> >> 80637 München
> >> Germany
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

Jacques Le Roux

Re: accounting

Administrator

In reply to this post by Jeroen van der Wal-2

Interesting!

Neogia has its own, it's the only one I know out there.
Looks like we are a bit behind on this aspect, despite all Jacopo's and HWM team's effort. Maybe it's time that other people, teams
help...

Jacques

From: "Jeroen van der Wal" <[hidden email]>

> These links will provide an insight different Chart of Accounts. I
> know for a fact that companies in UK, Netherlands, Italy and
> Switserland can choose their own chart of accounts.
> http://wiki.openbravo.com/wiki/Localization_Downloads
> http://doc.openerp.com/technical_guide/l10n_chart_be_frnl.html?highlight=l10n_chart#module-l10n_chart_be_frnl
>
> Jeroen van der Wal
>
> On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:47 PM, Info Olagos <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Bonjour Jacques,
>>
>> I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
>> same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
>>
>> Bien à vous,
>> Heidi
>>
>> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>>
>>> If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
>>> already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
>>> implementation for SME (TerCompta)
>>> Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
>>> I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
>>>
>>> Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your document.
>>> I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
>>>
>>> Jacques
>>>
>>> From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> Hello Karsten,
>>>
>>> Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
>>> I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
>>> you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
>>> But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
>>> Germany.
>>>
>>> Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
>>> So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
>>>
>>> That is a first step, i think.
>>>
>>> PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
>>>
>>> regards,
>>> Heidi
>>>
>>> 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like to
>>>> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
>>>> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
>>>> what
>>>> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>>>>
>>>> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
>>>> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should be
>>>> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
>>>> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
>>>> commercial
>>>> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>>>>
>>>> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.
>>>>
>>>> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the WIKI:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>>>>
>>>> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
>>>> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc
>>>> is
>>>> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Carsten
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>>>>
>>>> > Hello,
>>>> >
>>>> > About accounting:
>>>> >
>>>> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
>>>> > another country for example?
>>>> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
>>>> > ofbiz?
>>>> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
>>>> > journal and a bank journal?
>>>> >
>>>> > thanks,
>>>> >
>>>> > Heidi
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Best
>>>>
>>>> Carsten Schinzer
>>>>
>>>> Waisenhausstr. 53a
>>>> 80637 München
>>>> Germany
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by Jacques Le Roux

Hello Jacques,

I had a look to the demo of TerCompta.
This seems to be alike much more to the Belgium system.
I think the chart of accounts is more adapted to the Belgium system but i
have to investigate it more.
In every case accounts 6... and 7... are more the same i think.
There is however a difference in the reporting of the taxes i think which is
always based on standard documents and fields with certain numbers as
identifier.

regards,
Heidi

2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>

c.schinzer

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by Jacques Le Roux

here it is:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-3411

2010/1/14 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>

> Hi Carsten,
>
> Yes a Jira seems appropriate.
>
> Thanks
>
> Jacques
>
> From: "Carsten Schinzer" <[hidden email]>
>
> Hi Heidi,
>
> Legislation on Finance Report structure in DE:
> * Handels-Gesetzbuch (HGB) Paragraph 266
> For larger Organisations:
> * Bilanz Richtlinien Gesetz (BiRiLiG)
>
> If you search for either term on google.de you will find good results.
>
> I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure as
> XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for improvement
> and attach stuff there.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>
> Bonjour Jacques,
>>
>> I guess or i hope the ledgers in the different european countries are the
>> same, but it is the first task i want to perform.
>>
>> Bien ą vous,
>> Heidi
>>
>> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>>
>> > If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
>> > already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
>> > implementation for SME (TerCompta)
>> > Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
>> > I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
>> >
>> > Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your
>> document.
>> > I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
>> >
>> > Jacques
>> >
>> > From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
>> >
>> > Hello Karsten,
>> >
>> > Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
>> > I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think
>> as
>> > you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
>> > But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
>> > Germany.
>> >
>> > Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
>> > So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
>> >
>> > That is a first step, i think.
>> >
>> > PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
>> >
>> > regards,
>> > Heidi
>> >
>> > 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>> >
>> > I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like
>> to
>> >> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
>> >> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
>> >> what
>> >> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>> >>
>> >> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany.
>> E.g.
>> >> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should
>> be
>> >> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market
>> which
>> >> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
>> >> commercial
>> >> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>> >>
>> >> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this
>> matter.
>> >>
>> >> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the
>> WIKI:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>> >>
>> >> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
>> >> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the
>> doc
>> >> is
>> >> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>> >>
>> >> Regards
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Carsten
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>> >>
>> >> > Hello,
>> >> >
>> >> > About accounting:
>> >> >
>> >> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
>> >> > another country for example?
>> >> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium
>> in
>> >> > ofbiz?
>> >> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a
>> buy
>> >> > journal and a bank journal?
>> >> >
>> >> > thanks,
>> >> >
>> >> > Heidi
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >> Best
>> >>
>> >> Carsten Schinzer
>> >>
>> >> Waisenhausstr. 53a
>> >> 80637 München
>> >> Germany
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Best
>
> Carsten Schinzer
>
> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> 80637 München
> Germany
>
>
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

Jacques Le Roux

Re: accounting

Administrator

In reply to this post by Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Cool, would be great if you could enter the result of your investigations, thought, etc. in the wiki somewhere.
Then the community will be able to share and to help at some point

Thanks

Jacques

From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
Hello Jacques,

I had a look to the demo of TerCompta.
This seems to be alike much more to the Belgium system.
I think the chart of accounts is more adapted to the Belgium system but i
have to investigate it more.
In every case accounts 6... and 7... are more the same i think.
There is however a difference in the reporting of the taxes i think which is
always based on standard documents and fields with certain numbers as
identifier.

regards,
Heidi

2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

i will do.

Heidi

2010/1/14 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>

> Cool, would be great if you could enter the result of your investigations,
> thought, etc. in the wiki somewhere.
> Then the community will be able to share and to help at some point
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Jacques
>
> From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
> Hello Jacques,
>
> I had a look to the demo of TerCompta.
> This seems to be alike much more to the Belgium system.
> I think the chart of accounts is more adapted to the Belgium system but i
> have to investigate it more.
> In every case accounts 6... and 7... are more the same i think.
> There is however a difference in the reporting of the taxes i think which
> is
> always based on standard documents and fields with certain numbers as
> identifier.
>
> regards,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/13 Jacques Le Roux <[hidden email]>
>
> If I had time this would interest me as well, though in France there is
>> already Neogia with its own implementation, and even now an
>> implementation for SME (TerCompta)
>> Sometimes I wonder if Jacopo will not work on this one day for Italia...
>> I have also the felling that in EU the ledger are similar, isn'it?
>>
>> Also Carstein, I quickly saw that you put a Taxes section in your
>> document.
>> I suppose you are aware about the VAT page in the wiki?
>>
>> Jacques
>>
>> From: "Info Olagos" <[hidden email]>
>>
>> Hello Karsten,
>>
>> Yes it is interesting for me also to work together on accounting.
>> I want to have an idea how the ledger is structured in Germany. I think as
>> you said it is also like in Belgium legally binded.
>> But i don´t find the legally minimum of the ledger or Hauptbuch from
>> Germany.
>>
>> Can you spot on an copy of the Hauptbuch for me ?
>> So i can compare the ledger of Germany with the ledger of Belgium.
>>
>> That is a first step, i think.
>>
>> PS.: nice document you made in the wiki.
>>
>> regards,
>> Heidi
>>
>> 2010/1/13 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>>
>> I have done some prestudy on this, but actually I would really also like
>> to
>>
>>> understand whether anyone on the list has done such thing.
>>> I can forward a brief analysis that at least by Entity dataset assesses
>>> what
>>> needs to be change for customisation vs. localization.
>>>
>>> And I have started to work on adopting the GL structure for Germany. E.g.
>>> there is specific legislation as to how the Annual Balance sheet should
>>> be
>>> structured and we do also have an organisation in the german market which
>>> defines an Accoutnign Scheme (DATEV) that is implemented in most
>>> commercial
>>> accounting tools. I would like to get OFBiz using that scheme as well.
>>>
>>> So maybe if we do not find anyone, we start collaborating on this matter.
>>>
>>> I have started to depict certain aspects on a Technical Guide on the
>>> WIKI:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/Guide+to+OFBiz-i18n%2C++Internationalisation+of+OFBiz
>>>
>>> Feel free to comment and adapt according to your findings.
>>> Also please let me know whether I need to explain more. Note that the doc
>>> is
>>> W.I.P. hence any feedback is welcome and appreciated.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>>
>>> Carsten
>>>
>>>
>>> 2010/1/13 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> > Hello,
>>> >
>>> > About accounting:
>>> >
>>> > a) Is it easy to change the ledger accounts to another schema used in
>>> > another country for example?
>>> > b) Has anyone already implemented the ledger schema used in Belgium in
>>> > ofbiz?
>>> > c) How to configure the journals for example a vendor journal and a buy
>>> > journal and a bank journal?
>>> >
>>> > thanks,
>>> >
>>> > Heidi
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Best
>>>
>>> Carsten Schinzer
>>>
>>> Waisenhausstr. 53a
>>> 80637 München
>>> Germany
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

Jacopo Cappellato-4

Re: accounting

In reply to this post by c.schinzer

Hi Carsten,

On Jan 14, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Carsten Schinzer wrote:

> I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure as
> XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for improvement
> and attach stuff there.

yes, please create a Jira ticket and attach the file or patch to it; contribution like this could go into the official project (as demo data that is not loaded by default).
Do you have only gl account classes or a full chart of accounts?

Kind regards,

Jacopo

c.schinzer

Re: accounting

Hi Jacopo,

well .... errrr .... sort of in the middle of it.
I can thus attach examples of what I did so far, but it's all untested yet.

I am especially stuck on the part t hat connects the GL setting to OFBiz
specifics such as InvoiceItems, default accounts ..

I have included the reference to the WIKI doc on i18n (though it makes sens
to boild out ideas on the wiki rather than on the JIRA ticket.

Regards

Carsten

2010/1/14 Jacopo Cappellato <[hidden email]>

> Hi Carsten,
>
> On Jan 14, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Carsten Schinzer wrote:
>
> > I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266 structure
> as
> > XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> > Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for
> improvement
> > and attach stuff there.
>
> yes, please create a Jira ticket and attach the file or patch to it;
> contribution like this could go into the official project (as demo data that
> is not loaded by default).
> Do you have only gl account classes or a full chart of accounts?
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Jacopo
>
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

Carsten,

I think you should set also in your i18n document on wiki, the
DemoGeneralChartOfAccounts.xml GlAccount demo
to be localised.

Regards,
Heidi

2010/1/14 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>

> Hi Jacopo,
>
>
> well .... errrr .... sort of in the middle of it.
> I can thus attach examples of what I did so far, but it's all untested
> yet.
>
> I am especially stuck on the part t hat connects the GL setting to OFBiz
> specifics such as InvoiceItems, default accounts ..
>
> I have included the reference to the WIKI doc on i18n (though it makes sens
> to boild out ideas on the wiki rather than on the JIRA ticket.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> 2010/1/14 Jacopo Cappellato <[hidden email]>
>
> > Hi Carsten,
> >
> > On Jan 14, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Carsten Schinzer wrote:
> >
> > > I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266
> structure
> > as
> > > XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> > > Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for
> > improvement
> > > and attach stuff there.
> >
> > yes, please create a Jira ticket and attach the file or patch to it;
> > contribution like this could go into the official project (as demo data
> that
> > is not loaded by default).
> > Do you have only gl account classes or a full chart of accounts?
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> > Jacopo
> >
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Best
>
> Carsten Schinzer
>
> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> 80637 München
> Germany
>

c.schinzer

Re: accounting

Morning Heidi,

indeed I thought that as well, but finally, it's each company's decision
which GL they would like to use; hence I rather think the demo account
definitions are what they are: DEMO data. Hence to be customized per
customer.

An option would be to define various "boilerplate" demo data sets that work,
e.g. a GL that reflects typical Charts of accounts.
Let me know your thoughts.

Regards

Carsten

2010/1/15 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>

> Carsten,
>
> I think you should set also in your i18n document on wiki, the
> DemoGeneralChartOfAccounts.xml GlAccount demo
> to be localised.
>
> Regards,
> Heidi
>
> 2010/1/14 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
>
> > Hi Jacopo,
> >
> >
> > well .... errrr .... sort of in the middle of it.
> > I can thus attach examples of what I did so far, but it's all untested
> > yet.
> >
> > I am especially stuck on the part t hat connects the GL setting to OFBiz
> > specifics such as InvoiceItems, default accounts ..
> >
> > I have included the reference to the WIKI doc on i18n (though it makes
> sens
> > to boild out ideas on the wiki rather than on the JIRA ticket.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> >
> > Carsten
> >
> >
> > 2010/1/14 Jacopo Cappellato <[hidden email]>
> >
> > > Hi Carsten,
> > >
> > > On Jan 14, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Carsten Schinzer wrote:
> > >
> > > > I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266
> > structure
> > > as
> > > > XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> > > > Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for
> > > improvement
> > > > and attach stuff there.
> > >
> > > yes, please create a Jira ticket and attach the file or patch to it;
> > > contribution like this could go into the official project (as demo data
> > that
> > > is not loaded by default).
> > > Do you have only gl account classes or a full chart of accounts?
> > >
> > > Kind regards,
> > >
> > > Jacopo
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Best
> >
> > Carsten Schinzer
> >
> > Waisenhausstr. 53a
> > 80637 München
> > Germany
> >
>

--

Best

Carsten Schinzer

Waisenhausstr. 53a
80637 München
Germany

Heidi Dehaes - Olagos

Re: accounting

Hello Carsten,

I have in mind to add a xml file with the minimum legal (!) chart of
accounts to be used in Flemish and French spoken Belgium , but still have
some questionsl:
Because in our country it is a minimum legal thing, i think we should add
them in the xml file.

a) for Germany is there no legal minimum chart of accounts to be used. ARe
people completely free to organisez their own chart of accounts?

b)
I want to know if we can modify the GlAccountClass records in the xml file?
They are:
Debit
Credit
Resource
Asset
Current Asset
Cash and Equivalent
Inventory Asset
Long Term Asset
Liability
Current Liability
Long Term Liability
Equity
Owners Equity
REtained Earnings
Equity Distribution
REturn of Capital
Dividends
REvenue
Income
Cash Income
Non-Cash Income
Expense
Cash Expense
Interest Expense
Cost of Goods Sold Expense
Selling, General and Administrative Expense
Non-Cash Expense
Depreciation
Amortization
Inventory Adjustment
Accumulated Depreciation
Accumulated Amortization
Non-Posting

Are these id's of these descriptions used anywhere in ofbiz hardcoded or
not?
HAs anyone an idea how this works.
Eventually i want to modify them for other localizations.

For localisation we have perhaps to modify them (= add or remove some
items?) . Is that allowed?

regards,
Heidi

2010/1/15 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>

> Morning Heidi,
>
>
> indeed I thought that as well, but finally, it's each company's decision
> which GL they would like to use; hence I rather think the demo account
> definitions are what they are: DEMO data. Hence to be customized per
> customer.
>
> An option would be to define various "boilerplate" demo data sets that
> work,
> e.g. a GL that reflects typical Charts of accounts.
> Let me know your thoughts.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> 2010/1/15 Info Olagos <[hidden email]>
>
> > Carsten,
> >
> > I think you should set also in your i18n document on wiki, the
> > DemoGeneralChartOfAccounts.xml GlAccount demo
> > to be localised.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Heidi
> >
> > 2010/1/14 Carsten Schinzer <[hidden email]>
> >
> > > Hi Jacopo,
> > >
> > >
> > > well .... errrr .... sort of in the middle of it.
> > > I can thus attach examples of what I did so far, but it's all untested
> > > yet.
> > >
> > > I am especially stuck on the part t hat connects the GL setting to
> OFBiz
> > > specifics such as InvoiceItems, default accounts ..
> > >
> > > I have included the reference to the WIKI doc on i18n (though it makes
> > sens
> > > to boild out ideas on the wiki rather than on the JIRA ticket.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > >
> > >
> > > Carsten
> > >
> > >
> > > 2010/1/14 Jacopo Cappellato <[hidden email]>
> > >
> > > > Hi Carsten,
> > > >
> > > > On Jan 14, 2010, at 12:19 PM, Carsten Schinzer wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I do have an OFBiz config artifact containing the HGB Para 266
> > > structure
> > > > as
> > > > > XML Emtity Config for GlAccountingClasses.
> > > > > Question: How to share this ... I could open a JIRA ticket for
> > > > improvement
> > > > > and attach stuff there.
> > > >
> > > > yes, please create a Jira ticket and attach the file or patch to it;
> > > > contribution like this could go into the official project (as demo
> data
> > > that
> > > > is not loaded by default).
> > > > Do you have only gl account classes or a full chart of accounts?
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards,
> > > >
> > > > Jacopo
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Best
> > >
> > > Carsten Schinzer
> > >
> > > Waisenhausstr. 53a
> > > 80637 München
> > > Germany
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Best
>
> Carsten Schinzer
>
> Waisenhausstr. 53a
> 80637 München
> Germany
>