JUEL rounding issues

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JUEL rounding issues

Scott Gray-2
Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's  
numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some  
example code:
<set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
<set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
<set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}" type="BigDecimal"/>
<log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>

and here are some example results:
0.0001 / 10 = 0
10 / 3 = 3
10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
10 - 2.5001 = 7.5

I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here  
so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you  
have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.

Regards
Scott

HotWax Media
http://www.hotwaxmedia.com


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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Vince Clark
I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.

I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.

Vince Clark
www.globalera.com
[hidden email]
(303) 493-6723 office
(303) 523-4843 cell


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: JUEL rounding issues

Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's  
numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some  
example code:
<set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
<set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
<set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}" type="BigDecimal"/>
<log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>

and here are some example results:
0.0001 / 10 = 0
10 / 3 = 3
10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
10 - 2.5001 = 7.5

I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here  
so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you  
have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.

Regards
Scott

HotWax Media
http://www.hotwaxmedia.com

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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Scott Gray-2
That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I  
just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a  
decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.

Regards
Scott

On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:

> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>
> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>
> Vince Clark
> www.globalera.com
> [hidden email]
> (303) 493-6723 office
> (303) 523-4843 cell
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
> Mountain
> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>
> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
> example code:
> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"  
> type="BigDecimal"/>
> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>
> and here are some example results:
> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
> 10 / 3 = 3
> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>
> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here
> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you
> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> HotWax Media
> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>


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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Vince Clark
Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at least you have control over it.



Vince Clark
www.globalera.com
[hidden email]
(303) 493-6723 office
(303) 523-4843 cell


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues

That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I  
just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a  
decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.

Regards
Scott

On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:

> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>
> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>
> Vince Clark
> www.globalera.com
> [hidden email]
> (303) 493-6723 office
> (303) 523-4843 cell
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
> Mountain
> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>
> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
> example code:
> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"  
> type="BigDecimal"/>
> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>
> and here are some example results:
> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
> 10 / 3 = 3
> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>
> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here
> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you
> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> HotWax Media
> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>

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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Scott Gray-2
I would prefer it if no rounding occurs anywhere, there's really only  
two places it needs to occur:
1.  For division (even then only when the result would cause infinite  
precision e.g. 10 / 3)
2.  When you're ready to arrive at the final result in a series of  
calculations

Regards
Scott

On 10/09/2009, at 7:47 PM, Vince Clark wrote:

> Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at least  
> you have control over it.
>
>
>
> Vince Clark
> www.globalera.com
> [hidden email]
> (303) 493-6723 office
> (303) 523-4843 cell
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
> Mountain
> Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues
>
> That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I
> just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a
> decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>
>> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>>
>> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>>
>> Vince Clark
>> www.globalera.com
>> [hidden email]
>> (303) 493-6723 office
>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada
>> Mountain
>> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>>
>> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
>> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
>> example code:
>> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
>> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
>> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"
>> type="BigDecimal"/>
>> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>>
>> and here are some example results:
>> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
>> 10 / 3 = 3
>> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
>> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
>> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>>
>> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here
>> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you
>> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>>
>> Regards
>> Scott
>>
>> HotWax Media
>> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>>
>


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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Jacques Le Roux
Administrator
+1

Jacques

From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>

>I would prefer it if no rounding occurs anywhere, there's really only  
> two places it needs to occur:
> 1.  For division (even then only when the result would cause infinite  
> precision e.g. 10 / 3)
> 2.  When you're ready to arrive at the final result in a series of  
> calculations
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> On 10/09/2009, at 7:47 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>
>> Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at least  
>> you have control over it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Vince Clark
>> www.globalera.com
>> [hidden email]
>> (303) 493-6723 office
>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
>> Mountain
>> Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues
>>
>> That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I
>> just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a
>> decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.
>>
>> Regards
>> Scott
>>
>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>
>>> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>>>
>>> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>>>
>>> Vince Clark
>>> www.globalera.com
>>> [hidden email]
>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada
>>> Mountain
>>> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>>>
>>> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
>>> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
>>> example code:
>>> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"
>>> type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>>>
>>> and here are some example results:
>>> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
>>> 10 / 3 = 3
>>> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
>>> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
>>> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>>>
>>> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here
>>> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you
>>> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Scott
>>>
>>> HotWax Media
>>> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>>>
>>
>
>

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Re: JUEL rounding issues

David E. Jones-2
In reply to this post by Scott Gray-2

There is one other very general case I can think of: When you do a  
floating point multiply or divide you can get some pretty crazy  
numbers if you don't round. The solution is to do fixed point math,  
but even then for currency you can do a multiplication and get more  
digits that the 2 normally desired (unless you are doing certain  
things like tax calculations where you want 3 digits for the interim  
values and round to 2 digits after the interim values are added  
together).

-David


On Sep 10, 2009, at 1:56 AM, Scott Gray wrote:

> I would prefer it if no rounding occurs anywhere, there's really  
> only two places it needs to occur:
> 1.  For division (even then only when the result would cause  
> infinite precision e.g. 10 / 3)
> 2.  When you're ready to arrive at the final result in a series of  
> calculations
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> On 10/09/2009, at 7:47 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>
>> Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at least  
>> you have control over it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Vince Clark
>> www.globalera.com
>> [hidden email]
>> (303) 493-6723 office
>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
>> Mountain
>> Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues
>>
>> That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I
>> just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a
>> decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.
>>
>> Regards
>> Scott
>>
>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>
>>> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>>>
>>> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>>>
>>> Vince Clark
>>> www.globalera.com
>>> [hidden email]
>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada
>>> Mountain
>>> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>>>
>>> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
>>> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
>>> example code:
>>> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"
>>> type="BigDecimal"/>
>>> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>>>
>>> and here are some example results:
>>> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
>>> 10 / 3 = 3
>>> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
>>> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
>>> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>>>
>>> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here
>>> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if  
>>> you
>>> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Scott
>>>
>>> HotWax Media
>>> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>>>
>>
>

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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Scott Gray-2
Crazy numbers are only a problem for final values though right?  Take  
a basic tax calc for example:
quantity * price = interim value (no rounding)
interim value * tax rate = final value (rounded 3dp, displayed to user  
and stored in db)

Regards
Scott


On 10/09/2009, at 9:35 PM, David E Jones wrote:

>
> There is one other very general case I can think of: When you do a  
> floating point multiply or divide you can get some pretty crazy  
> numbers if you don't round. The solution is to do fixed point math,  
> but even then for currency you can do a multiplication and get more  
> digits that the 2 normally desired (unless you are doing certain  
> things like tax calculations where you want 3 digits for the interim  
> values and round to 2 digits after the interim values are added  
> together).
>
> -David
>
>
> On Sep 10, 2009, at 1:56 AM, Scott Gray wrote:
>
>> I would prefer it if no rounding occurs anywhere, there's really  
>> only two places it needs to occur:
>> 1.  For division (even then only when the result would cause  
>> infinite precision e.g. 10 / 3)
>> 2.  When you're ready to arrive at the final result in a series of  
>> calculations
>>
>> Regards
>> Scott
>>
>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:47 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>
>>> Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at  
>>> least you have control over it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Vince Clark
>>> www.globalera.com
>>> [hidden email]
>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada  
>>> Mountain
>>> Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues
>>>
>>> That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the way I
>>> just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a
>>> decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Scott
>>>
>>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>>
>>>> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>>>>
>>>> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>>>>
>>>> Vince Clark
>>>> www.globalera.com
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada
>>>> Mountain
>>>> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>>>>
>>>> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
>>>> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
>>>> example code:
>>>> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"
>>>> type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>>>>
>>>> and here are some example results:
>>>> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
>>>> 10 / 3 = 3
>>>> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
>>>> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
>>>> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>>>>
>>>> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting  
>>>> here
>>>> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if  
>>>> you
>>>> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>> HotWax Media
>>>> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>>>>
>>>
>>
>


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Re: JUEL rounding issues

Adrian Crum
In reply to this post by Scott Gray-2
Thanks for reporting that Scott. I will look into it when I have time.

I'm wondering if the rounding is being done in JUEL, or in displaying
the value 7.499.

-Adrian

Scott Gray wrote:

> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's some
> example code:
> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}" type="BigDecimal"/>
> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>
> and here are some example results:
> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
> 10 / 3 = 3
> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>
> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting here so
> people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but if you have
> any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> HotWax Media
> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>
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Re: JUEL rounding issues

David E. Jones-2
In reply to this post by Scott Gray-2

It's not just for final values. Even in the current code for  
calculating taxes you'll see the stuff to round each item's tax and  
then round the total too. There are a few places, mostly the VAT and  
VAT-ish countries, that require rounding each item's value to 3  
decimals and then rounding the sum to 2 decimals to get a real  
currency value.

Stepping back a little: I'm not sure how this helps us (or makes  
things more complicated)... is there some simplification of code  
somewhere that you have in mind that would depend on these things?

-David


On Sep 10, 2009, at 3:53 AM, Scott Gray wrote:

> Crazy numbers are only a problem for final values though right?  
> Take a basic tax calc for example:
> quantity * price = interim value (no rounding)
> interim value * tax rate = final value (rounded 3dp, displayed to  
> user and stored in db)
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
>
> On 10/09/2009, at 9:35 PM, David E Jones wrote:
>
>>
>> There is one other very general case I can think of: When you do a  
>> floating point multiply or divide you can get some pretty crazy  
>> numbers if you don't round. The solution is to do fixed point math,  
>> but even then for currency you can do a multiplication and get more  
>> digits that the 2 normally desired (unless you are doing certain  
>> things like tax calculations where you want 3 digits for the  
>> interim values and round to 2 digits after the interim values are  
>> added together).
>>
>> -David
>>
>>
>> On Sep 10, 2009, at 1:56 AM, Scott Gray wrote:
>>
>>> I would prefer it if no rounding occurs anywhere, there's really  
>>> only two places it needs to occur:
>>> 1.  For division (even then only when the result would cause  
>>> infinite precision e.g. 10 / 3)
>>> 2.  When you're ready to arrive at the final result in a series of  
>>> calculations
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Scott
>>>
>>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:47 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes the default is too small if precision is an issue. But at  
>>>> least you have control over it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Vince Clark
>>>> www.globalera.com
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:41:58 AM GMT -07:00 US/
>>>> Canada Mountain
>>>> Subject: Re: JUEL rounding issues
>>>>
>>>> That is one solution but it would be nice to fix JUEL.  By the  
>>>> way I
>>>> just had quick look at the calculate method and if you don't set a
>>>> decimal-scale then 2 is used which seems a bit of a worry as well.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>> On 10/09/2009, at 7:34 PM, Vince Clark wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I don't know much about UEL but did run into a rounding issue.
>>>>>
>>>>> I chose to instead use <calculate> so I could control precision.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vince Clark
>>>>> www.globalera.com
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> (303) 493-6723 office
>>>>> (303) 523-4843 cell
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Scott Gray" <[hidden email]>
>>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 1:27:08 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada
>>>>> Mountain
>>>>> Subject: JUEL rounding issues
>>>>>
>>>>> Out of curiosity today I ran a couple of simple tests using JUEL's
>>>>> numeric expressions and the results are a bit worrying, here's  
>>>>> some
>>>>> example code:
>>>>> <set field="value1" value="0.0001" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>>> <set field="value2" value="10" type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>>> <set field="resultValue" value="${value1 / value2}"
>>>>> type="BigDecimal"/>
>>>>> <log level="always" message="${resultValue}"></log>
>>>>>
>>>>> and here are some example results:
>>>>> 0.0001 / 10 = 0
>>>>> 10 / 3 = 3
>>>>> 10.89879 + 6.8978336 = 17.797
>>>>> 10.89879 * 6.8978336 = 75.178
>>>>> 10 - 2.5001 = 7.5
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't have time right this minute to fix it so just reporting  
>>>>> here
>>>>> so people are aware.  Adrian, I'm not asking you to fix it but  
>>>>> if you
>>>>> have any pointers or suggestions they'd be most welcome.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> Scott
>>>>>
>>>>> HotWax Media
>>>>> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>